Interesting. Um, if J Who Garcia is around I would love to have you come on up because J's got a really cool perspective. He's uh, been driving the Rivan and uh I don't know I was talking to him today when we were looking at the Cyber truck itself and he wasn't like all of us I think our miles were open and we were just like this is the Cyber truck U but he wasn't and I I' would love to get his perspective on it cuz you know he's a big Eevee guy knock on there's J come on up hey I feel like you're not the biggest cybertruck fan aesthetically I'm not the biggest fan. Well you don't like the sweeping curves and the um okay, so when I saw it I wasn't initially a fan right? I think things grow on people and so I think pretty soon it's going to be the norm and people are going to accept it right? But I'm talking about you though.

Has it grown on you yet? It's taken a while I still not 100% on board with that. but of course I haven't seen the production other than the one that was here earlier and I as you saw I didn't go up close to it and I was like looking at it and stuff. Okay, but so to you is it like the little intricate things that makes you love it or hate it or is it just the overall aesthetic? I think it was the overall aesthetic but like as I was talking to you earlier, it's changed. The original cyber truck was not the same shape as this one.

the production right? It feels like the original was more of a pyramid. like more. more pointy, right? Yes, it was a big grotesque I would say he used the word grotesque folks J Garcia Everybody I I know I know there's a lot of fans here, but um, it's You know there are other renders that I saw in the internet about uh, cyber fine, other cars and I was like oh my God like that's amazing so it's not I think it was just a Dimensions I think that's what I was. you know is this just because you're a Rivan truck owner now oo and you've fallen in love with that oval no well light in the front? Well I did like this the Rivan truck as soon as I saw it.

and by the way, I didn't like the Rivan truck I like the Rivian SUV Oh, you like the R1s Yes, that's what I signed up for. but because they made us buy the truck first so then we're all got to be the stupid truck, you know? But I'm not really a truck fan. so I think that might be another reason why I'm not a huge fan of this type of truck because I have a truck and then I have the SUV And as I was telling you before, I'm a bigger fan of the SUV and I think most people on the street are a fan of the SUV Well let me stop you there. So you're not a fan of trucks in general like you're more of a van guy, right? Yes, say minivan.

Um, classic minivans. Classic minivans. When we started driving trucks, um I found so much use for them had did you do the same thing that you start throwing stuff in the back that you hadn't thought of before? um I Want to say traditionally I would I started in the trades I'm a carpenter by trade. nice, you know, really carpenters and so yeah, for many years in my life in a previous life I tow around uh, boxes of tools and I would throw them in like a mini truck and stuff you know.

and so yeah. I think now I have a company and we carry big heavy stuff and I have thrown big stuff on there in my fancy truck. You know, Yes, you mean you put it in very carefully. No.

I have dented like I've scratched the thing. You know what I mean like. So now it looks like there's stuff that's been back. Oh, so you've dented up your truck.

not dented it, but scratched the liner. The truck's not really for work. No, it's it's for Adventures It's for Adventures people. it's like a it's a fancy car that looks like a truck.

That's how I would explain it. Uh, because trucks with a very small bed with a very small bed You know trucks don't do three. you know, 06 in 3 seconds. So it's not really.

Yeah, can we talk about bed size for a second? So I don't want to get too personal. but but bed size on the rivan I think is what? 54 in if I remember correctly whereas on the Cyber Tru we just learned it's going to be 72 72 right? So I feel like yeah, there's a whole bunch of things I tried to put in the rivan and then we were like oh, this doesn't fit without the tailgate down well I Want to talk about that for a second? The 72 in where is that measured to is that the biggest Dimension or is that the smallest Dimension because in the back of the Cyber truck, if you've seen it right at the right at the bed level goes all the way back then it comes to the cab section. There's no midgate. sad face uh comes up.

but then it kind of angles in. So my question is this is the 72 in just along the bed. Which is helpful because if you're moving flat Goods like plywood and stuff like that, that's good. But you know if I want to store like a bike or something tall, is it going to be able to be 72 in from the bottom to the top? So what dimension is it? Cuz maybe the bed's even longer.

Maybe the bed at the bottom is even longer. than it is towards the top? That would be great I mean and by the way, why 72 in? Because if you're trying to put a Ply a sheet of plywood, well, that's not 72 in. it's more like 84 or something like that, right? I mean you're going to have to put the tailgate down right? It's mainly because I think if you go for a full 8ft bed and the crew cab, you're just talking very hard to park. Yes, Well, let's talk about parking.

Rivan is pretty easy to park. No I've find it without that camera I'm terrible at parking. My wife is a lot better than me parking like she's just pulls up in there and obviously she's driven the Rivan more than me. I Got a truck only as a, you know, hand me- down kind of thing.

I Find it hard to par, especially in La The parking spots are small everywhere you go and so it's I think it's borderline. it's not as big as like a F 250 or something like those are really hard apart. So yeah it, it's doable. but it's not the easiest thing in the world going from a smaller model 3.

That's what we used to drive before the rym uh yeah, it's a it's a it's a difference. Like there's quite bit of difference. What about the rear steering? So on the Cyber truck there's going to be rear steering I Don't know if that's going to be in all the variants or not, but rear steering seems like it could be a game changer in terms of not only Towing but just you know. tight turns and all that.

Yeah! I Have found on the truck that it doesn't turn very tight and I have had to do this Atin power thing back and forth. so I don't know if it's the same with the R1s. I So the R1s is one foot shorter so it does turn a little bit quicker. I Think it's going to be great on the on the Cyber truck that you have rear Theory I Think it's going to make a huge difference.

It's going to prevent you from having to do the all right. So you're one of those people who didn't quite buy into the look right away. That's fine, a lot of people didn't But what I want to ask you is how soon do you think it'll be before? or do you think that this will be true? That the kind of world will just start to accept this design and then want more of this design? I Think it's going to happen quickly like the DeLorean right? which I think it has a similar aesthetic s similar materials and stuff and I think had had I been alive and an adult in the days when it shipped out and it first I think I would have thought the same thing. It's kind of a stupid thing.

why is it like so Square why is it like where's the paint you know like I wanted in a where's the where's the paint like come on like I'm paying all this money and you don't even get a p paint Come on. But once we saw the movie Back to the Future Back to the Future then all we all became a fan. it. and I Want to say that big portion of our fandom for that car is the movie.

It's what makes us feel look Aesthetics is are very important in cars like I drive what is essentially the world's worst car. It's a 1950s BW bus. This is a terrible car and like any way you look at it, it's a terrible car. But but people love it.

But we all love it because it's iconic because we grew up with it because uh, aesthetically, it looks this little brown little was it in any kind of movies that made that way or is it just it's just so beautiful. was just in culture yeah yeah in culture. but but I want to push back on the DeLorean because if the DeLorean wasn't in Back to the Future and let's say it was a I don't know a Corvette that Marty goes back to the future in. uh do you think it's everyone's going to remember oh that's the Back to the Future car or was it really smart of the filmmaker to choose the DeLorean because the DeLorean really encapsulated what a time machine car should look like? Well, did you know that the filmmakers got approached by Ford and they got offered $75,000 if the time machine was a Mustang and he said oh, Doc Brown doesn't drive a Mustang So I want to say that because of the Aesthetics That's why we all because it's weird.

It's supposed to be weird. It's supposed to be not a normal car. So do you think if the cybertruck was in some big movies coming up or something that that would do the trick? That would do the trick I think for the mass Market although I don't think it needed look I'm obviously wrong cuz there's a million reservations. 2.1 million.

Oh two. Now of course I will have to say that it's $100 and I mean that's how much we spend on a fancy dinner, you know? And so so the commitment is. Are you saying that there's people out there who aren't going to want their truck? You're saying that there's people people out there who reserved more than one cyber truck that they might not buy? I mean for the same amount of money that it took me to reserve my rivan I could have reserved 10 cyber trucks. So yes, I want to say that there's going to be quite a bit of few people that are okay because there's a lot of things that have changed right since then the price has gone up.

We we don't know. oh we don't know, we don't know. but the price have to increase because I don't think did we have a price way back in day we didn't Okay so you're just signing up to just a truck without knowing the price. So now that well I mean Elon gave us some prices but we don't know if they're going to be true.

No, we know they're not going to be true, right We come on. Who are we getting here like? All right, what do you think the prices are going to be I Want to say they're going to be like Simar to Rivan they're going to be 80 and then top trims are going to be 90 100. Oh you think starting price 80 75? Maybe 75? That's where I to get in under the federal tax credit? Yes but you think that's the starting like rear wheeel drive? yeah I would say interesting. Get it and we are going to the live stream now.

Uh I was on the Jo Rogan show and uh Joe bet me a dollar that his armor piercing steel head Arrow would go through the car it. uh H now he owes me a dollar. How does it work as a real everyday truck truck? Well here we have the future. Towing the future.

There's there's something uh in the truck world called a a truck pull. This is really the the key test of how much power does your truck actually have. Let's see what happens. standing around.

the Lo W can outp an F350 Diesel Uh has a massive towing capacity. Massive bed. Uh one. It's basically an incredibly useful truck.

So let's take it to the racetrack and see how how does the Cyber truck form against a Porsche 911 and I I Should say this is this is an actual Porsche We literally just got it from the dealer 2023 Porsche 911. But wait, there's more it can. It can tow a Porsche 9911 across a/4 mile faster than the Porsche 911 can grow by itself. You can just drive it to your house and bring it and put in your bed I don't know how they lift it you need? Well, it have to be on crot.

Tesla Bots it have to be on a crane. Um, but I could definitely see that happening. can I Yeah, come on up. J's got some ideas about the battery.

all right. So I don't know what I'm talking about here, but I just did some quick calculations and in order to get 130 miles it would have to be a battery. about yeah, how much would it weigh mic really close to your face? About 26 kilowatt hours if that's of course considering that the Cyber truck is has an efficiency of about 200 wat hours per mile now I don't know how off I'm there. but I feel you think it's going to have that good an efficiency I mean 100 Yeah, 3 is like too low.

That's way low. That's way low. Okay so then if that's the case, then the then the battery has to be bigger than that. Oh thank you.

Okay, so we're talking probably 30 K hours right? So how heavy is that power? WS Well yeah, that's three power walls. That's a lot. Yeah, that's big. So we're talking about 300 400 lb of batteries at least at least.

And in order to go on the bed? Yeah, you could have it small. You know. Uh, Power walls are what? 14 or what? are they power? Yeah, the yeah. 13 and 12 kilowatt hours.

So so three of them. it's a big. it's a big bed. You I mean I Watched the guys install them and like two two big guys need to move a power wall.

You would need almost like a cherry picker like an engine hoist to be able to put it up there. So that's kind of. My point is like if you buy this thing right then when you get it home, what do you? you can't get it out of it's it's in your bed for good Yes. Unless you have a little tool that you can pick it out, put it up.

Now the other thing is that you could store it in your garage and then it could be your power wall. Okay, a special Crane In your garage you need a hoist. It could be three power walls. It doesn't have to be a special better.

so it could be. If it could be three, it could be five. It could be seven. It could be 12.

It's the infinite Range extender. Now the other thing is, do we know what? Uh, like someone else had said, that it might just be something that you plug in there and I was thinking, do we know what plug it has on the bed We don't know what plug, but we just heard that it's 1/3 of the bed. We knew that there was going to be a maintenance hatch in the front half of the bed. right? We've seen this before it.

We didn't know what it was. We're like, is that storage and they're like, no, it's a maintenance hatch and it's like uh, well. I think we know what the maintenance hatch is for. So if it's just like a Nima 1450 then it would be capable of 11 KW Uh, Power Right, It's got to be DC It's got to be direct.

You're just plugging it onto the battery. Well, not necessarily you could. You could do back right? Because here's the thing. it doesn't have to 11.

Kow is nothing. You can't P push a car right. but it would be enough to supplement the US trical charge the battery. Yeah, yeah, because it doesn't have to power the truck, it just has to put back in 11.

Kow Okay except except and here's the only hole in your argument. It increases the 0 to 60 or decreases the 0 to 60 time makes the truck faster. That would tell me that it is a high power con. Adding more weight to a truck and it somehow gets faster.

The only way that happens is if it's pumping more amps. unless the the factor there like the it's it's uh, traction right? like. So adding more weight weight would adding more traction I don't know. Works well.

We don't know why. What's the limiting factor there? It might not be power. It might be TR You think it's just the track. All right? Maybe.

But I think I think that there's there's enough factors. There's the the maintenance hatch which I think is going to be the range extender battery hatch where you're going to stick the Range Extender on and then the fact that it gets faster. Those two things to me sound like you're going to take it to Tesla Service they're going to have a hoist. They're going to lower this battery in.

Some guy's going to plug it in with some Anderson connector something some beefy uh DC connection. Yeah to the battery pack and it's just going to be parall can I just conjecture something. It popped into my head. Okay, what if certain superchargers have the extender available and it's some kind of robot thing that lowers it into the bed of your truck.

So it's kind of like the original idea of Tesla where they would do the battery swap. Yeah, it's almost like a Neo battery battery swap, but it's a more limited battery swap and it's a little bit. Do you think that it's easier if it's you're taking something out of the bed of a truck as opposed to having to take the battery pack out of the bottom of a car? Yeah, especially if it's like 2,000 Yeah, you don't have to. now.

dig underground, drive the car over something, and align stuff. You're like I mean it could just be two dudes with a hoist and like some bolts, you know? Yeah, well and by the way, I'm sorry to say this, but like again, he's he did this already right. Like where he they engineered a replaceable battery. They even had a station that would do it and then just wasn't a battery extender.

That was the only difference, but it never made it to market right? I mean every single Tesla Model S had the technology it just it was never ref it supercharg deploy. So this could be one of those things. And it does answer the question for towing that a lot of people have. which is how am I supposed to tow with this truck now? That would get you? So we were were saying maybe a range of like like 230 Mi Towing uh Towing Towing cuz that's like if you took 470 and divid by two.

um, so you could conceivably get a range that was something like that. Um, but I it's usable. It's not as annoying as 150. Right now, 230 is getting into the range where that's totally doable.

It's not I think that that's like kind of standard supercharger travel that we're all getting kind of used to. Um, where you're like in the 200ish range and it's like that's a nice bathroom range right where you go for a drive. and if you're staying hydrated during your trip every two hours, you're going to probably need to make a pit stop anyway. not not such a big deal to have to.

uh to do that. Now let me ask you another question. Yeah, all right. What if this is a variable, uh voltage pack? What if the voltage of the I don't think this works but I'm I'm going to I'm to go for it anyway.

What if the voltage of the pack is normally 400? Vols uhhuh so you could supercharge normally? Then you go to the special place they add this on and instead of it being in parallel, it's in series and it makes your pack 8 Mak your pack 800 So therefore okay, so it's sure it's totally doable. Yeah, I mean you think so. especially? it would work right now that we're in this transitional period. What you could do would be head to the Version 4 supercharger charge up at a 800 volt charging speed which is going to be faster.

and because the battery is actually larger and is now 800 volts, it could actually accept it. and so then you could. That would allow you to charge faster. I Mean of course the battery pack could just be 800 volts and then you add in parallel another battery, but that would require uh, well, in order to charge in and like the current Charger 400 architecture right, you would require to have like a DC to DC like the Porsche or whatever and that's really an efficient way of doing that.

So you would think that the Tesla Engineers would be smarter than that and just do that. This is a big question though, cuz like you're saying so, the the Porsche Tyon right now has a 400 volt battery pack. It can pull into certain DC fast Chargers 800 volt fast Chargers and charge at high rates of speed I Thought it was the other way around I Thought it has an 800 volt pack and that's what I said no, no, you said 400 I'm sorry I meant it has an 800 volt pack. It can pull into some 800 volt Chargers and get that full speed.

but if it pulls into a 400 volt charger, it has to go through a Dcdc converter which is way slower. So now we're talking about the Cyber Tru most of the superchargers, the Version Three and Version two superchargers that we see out in the in the world. Normally they are 400 volts. Yeah.

and so the the Cyber truck would have to pull into that. Yeah, and it would need a DC Todc converter in order to get the full DC Like to get as much power as it could, but normally a DC DC converter isn't going to be rated for the hundreds of amps that. So the thing with the DC to DC it has. It's basically a charger.

It's basically with the the thing that we plug in there. so it's a giant box and in order to be 400 Kow I mean it has to be that big. That's why those things are that big. So that's why you can't have just an onboard piece of equipment that you only use just when you're going to charge in certain Chargers It just doesn't make sense right now.

Let me ask you this other question. So let's say that we have our supercharger pack and it's 800 volts. If I take a samurai sword and I slice that pack in half in just the right spot, don't I have two 400 volt packs? Okay, so it's usually chose the the serious count of battery. so right now we're the standard was 96 now.

I think Tesla's with the Plaid is like 108 or something like that. so you just have two of those and it'll be 200 cells 20. Now if I had a big old clunky switch and I could go clun and now all of a sudden they're separate packs. Contactors I could set I could charge it either at two supercharging stations or just split the power from one.

Yeah, you would just disconnect and Rec now I don't need the DC the Tes have this already. They have contactors so when you plug in your charg it at home, it's You Hear It Go Clunk. That's the contact. It disconnects that battery from the plug and it connects it through a DC to DC which is the onboard charger.

That's interesting and then when you plug it into a supercharger, it just reroutes it. So we we all that technolog is existing in the vehicles already right? and and so that is not actually hard to do to have two battery packs. Okay, so going back to the range extender. We're just thinking of it in terms of extending the range of the truck.

But what about when we power our homes Which he didn't talk about today? Yes, but is a feature that they said they're going to do exactly. So now this range extender is also a home range extender in the sense that you would be able to have more days, you know, power outage and so that could be another whole piece of this that he doesn't want to get into right now now. I'm starting to understand the Cyber truck is bigger than I even thought. And let's talk about the Bir directional charging I mean we talked about it just a little bit.

Um, so he was against it because it said it wasn't feasible. It wasn't people people wouldn't want to do it because it would would use up a cycle of your battery right? right? Uh, also like what happens if you're like oh, I need to power my house but oh I also have to go to the store Then it becomes let me ask you this. So we got three versions of the Cybertruck right? If I want the Be mode I probably have to have a lot of nickel in those batteries, right? It's probably a different architecture than if I want the, um, the lowest variant. Maybe those are Lfp and if those are Lfp I don't I can cycle them more, right? Yes, traditionally those have way way more more.

If I can cycle them more, maybe that's the choice For people who don't really want a performance truck but want to be able to. you know, power their house. So the dual motor. So you're saying there'd be a difference between the duel and beasts mode yeah, and the single motor.

Yeah, it's possible I mean the batteries would waight around the same, but they would have less capacity, but it would have a longer life span and you could. Yeah, you could definitely plug in. although didn't they say that the the two-way by directional thing? it's only on the top models? I Don't know. Maybe I don't know.

There's still that question, there's So of course there's some too many unanswered question. By the way, I was only off by $115,000 in the price, right? All right, hey, good for you. So I was closer but but not right on. Yeah, what number did you say? Yeah, what was your I said they would start around 75 and then would go all the way to 120 or 115 or something.

Okay, so it's even better than what you thought, right? Yeah, yeah, it I was $5 less. So they're They're more expensive than they announced, but not as expensive as I thought it was going to be. and maybe see that's the thing. Like he does have a a card up his sleeve, right? Because maybe manufacturing is not as expensive MH as everyone else Rivan and you know Ford have to deal with and so now he's like yeah, but it's It doesn't make sense to just slash the prices.

We'll leave that as as we can create more. It doesn't help that. tell all these people that you can buy a truck when we can't deliver, right? It's also I mean you know you don't want to piss off a bunch of people CU they can't get it I mean you've been waiting how long for that truck I Know four years, Four years and that's a long time to wait. That's a long time to wait.

That's a long time. Ask her if she waited four years for I Know it. It gets to the point where you almost don't want to think about it. You know, cuz like it's it's not fun to wait that long.

Yes, yeah and ALS Yeah Well thank you J This is great! So I just wanted. We probably have you up here again when the next battery question comes up. Thank you so much! J Garcia Everybody thank you.