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1) Where can learn more about batteries?
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All right, it is time we look and answer some of your comments and questions. I used to do this back in the day, but i haven't done it in a while. So let's do, let's get back to doing that today. As you know, i get a lot of comments and a lot of questions uh a lot of praise, a lot of hate, it all comes out and i don't i try to read all of it.

I i don't. I can't always get that. I skipped a lot of it. You know just because of uh, i have been limited in time and stuff, but every once in a while, you know you're, like you, keep seeing things that are like repeated, like things that people think things that people comment and i'm like.

Well, not really. You know, and then it goes in my and then i read that comment again so today. I want to address one of those comments. I think this person, i think just generally is, has some concerns about batteries and he posted his concerns in the batteries here and one of the latest videos that i did, and so i want to go point by point.

You know at least give my opinion of what this is right, so uh. The comment starts by saying most of these scooter and bike batteries are some flavor of nmc lithium battery chemistry that is 100 true. Yes, the nmc, i think, starts for nickel manganese cobalt. I think and some have aluminum in there and some have a different variations like uh combinations of these same three or four metals you know and the cathode usually right so trip nmc, lithium, carbon oxide.

I think it's another term for that same chemistry or the flavor of chemistry. Yes, that's correct. They are great for portable devices and portable power, but the more of them you get together in one place, the greater the chances of having a fault that causes a cell runaway condition. No, this is not true cells, don't know if they're alone or they're together, uh with a bunch of other cells right, like just pure fact of them being together, doesn't increase or decrease the chances of one of these having a runaway condition.

That's not how it works. Now cells have specs, and if you operate the batteries outside of the specs, then that will have an effect. If the cell, you know, gives you a problem or not. Now the the pure fact of having a bunch of them together doesn't indicate or doesn't suggest this uh, any particular factor being run out of spec right, and so no, this is a wrong statement.

This is an over generalization that should not be made. This is not how it works right. If cells are used within their specs within those narrow terms or whatever right, then batteries should be pretty safe, uh. So here's the thing batteries seem to people think that bad lithium batteries are dangerous and there's.

This is true and also not true right. They are dangerous. Just like anything else. Driving is dangerous right.

If you get a new car chances, are you can get an accident? You can die right, but the thing is: that is the question. The important question is how dangerous it is. Is it too dangerous for you to take part of that activity right? Does the benefit outweigh the risk and for the most part, i think most of us don't think about it, but we should think about it. We evaluate the risk factors and then you know we take a decision.

We do so then most of us we get into car, even though we know there's a chance that we can get hurt and we can die because it is a very useful thing to do. Right and so the same thing with these batteries by the way these batteries are dangerous. Yes, but they're, not too dangerous. These are the most common batteries in the world.

There's 7 billion humans on the planet and the vast majority i want to say 99.9 of humans are walking around with one of those nmc batteries in their pocket. Most of us charge these things next to us in our nightstand next to our bed like a foot away from our from our faces right on our heads. Okay are so some of these are gon na blow up and hurt some people. Yes, they do every year that happens, but the real important question is: is it too dangerous to be worth the risk, and the answer is clearly no most of us decide that, no, because most of us use a phone, a laptop uh, these batteries are trickling in Into all aspects of our lives and known kinds, i mean most of us have access or we use or depend on a daily basis to about 10 of these lithium batteries.

Now, right and most of them are this nmc type of batteries right, so so this is kind of over generalization right. If a person uses these, they keep saying right in their home, solar installation. They will likely need a separate condition shed to locate all the batteries in case. One ever goes up in flames as day 10 to get hot enough to spread to everything around them again.

No, okay, there's nothing wrong with you. Setting up a separate thing put them over there installing them. I i'm with you like, if you want to do that, go for it! If you want to increase your safety uh margins by whatever putting a rock around them, putting sheet rock putting them in the concrete thing or putting it inside a fire, uh proof, uh, safe or cabinet, or a thing go for it. I'm never gon na tell people not to do a thing that would make their battery safe, but the implication that he's saying is that these batteries get hot and then they get everything around again.

No, that is an over generalization that that is not true. These batteries have specs and if you work within those specs, these batteries are ultra safe and they don't get hot right. They don't get hot, they don't get hot any more than lithium choloxide than any of the other flavors or even lead acid batteries. If you don't pay attention to the specs on lead acid battery, and then you abuse it or neglect it or what those lead-acid batteries are dangerous too they can explode, they have acid, that's corrosive and it's poisonous and the risk is there.

If you are misusing batteries. If you're not designing a system correctly, then the risks go higher by by the simple fact that these are uh: nmc batteries, lithium, carbon oxide batteries. No, that fact alone does not add uh or have an effect in whether they're riskier or not. Now i do give you that they are less forgiving than some other, like lithium iron phosphate right, but that argument is different than what he's doing here.

This is an over generalization that should not be made um. A person may be able to get away with doing an inside bill if they can build all the batteries into a heavy duty. Metal enclosure that separates a large pack into several smaller packs. To reduce the number of packs that could be involved in one failed, if one fails catastrophically again, no, you could also get away with not doing that if you just use your batteries and design a system that is never going to put your cells outside of the Opera, normal operating specs right again, if you want to do that, separate them into separate battery packs that are isolated from each other.

Go for it that if you want to do that, go i will never advise getting something that will add safety to a battery, but you're basically saying that this is the only way you're like you're. I get the feeling you're like a black or white person. You know the world is black or white, like there's no gray in your world right, and so this kind of statement is like. No, that's not true.

There are many ways to operate these safely without having the the thing that you're describing here, it's it's. Maybe it's an extreme like to encase some other stuff like you could do that, and it would be a good idea, but it's not 100 necessary. These batteries are not this uh dangerous if you use them correctly right. So let's keep reading that on um.

I don't even trust the chemistry in a vehicle, since the chance of failure and terminal runaway is always looming overhead. Okay, so here is the thing now. What we're seeing is that you're describing that you are an anomaly you're, not the norm, you don't trust these batteries and electric vehicles by far like the most popular vehicle in the world. The tesla model 3 and model wine have this batteries underneath so you're saying, like? Oh, that's: that's uh! That's not safe right! So, okay, most of us that drive electric vehicles and there are going to drive evicted deals.

We're like these are safe enough. The the manufacturers that are putting these batteries on there, their lawyers, their agents. All these people are saying like okay, there's some risk in here, but we can mitigate it by using the cells within the specs they're, not too dangerous. That's why they're decreasing right, there's a tiny small number of vehicles that have other chemistries that are safer than these batteries right, and so you got to understand that when you're making these statements is from a place where you're uh not the norm, you're, not normal you're, Not your point of view, your fear of these batteries is not normal right and it might be based on something real.

Maybe you had a battery that blew up right, but a single incident doesn't change the fact that, statistically, these batteries are very, very safe right. When you look at the overall numbers, these batteries are safe enough to be used by a lot of people by a lot of things. Like i say we carry one in our pocket. We carry one of our backpacks, we're starting to use them and all kinds of things.

Um chemistries, like lithium iron, phosphate and lto, are far safer alternatives for home power wall storage - that is true, they are, they are much more forgiving chemistries and they are by that fact alone. Well, they're gon na they're gon na you're gon na be able to they're going to stand better and abuse, uh neglect and be you know, just doing something wrong with them, and even if, if it goes, you know things that there's no perfect systems in the world Right so even the best design engineer vehicles, you know the tesla, you know power wall could could go off and you have. They have been fires, they have been fires in cars, they have been fires in power, walls and uh power packs. They have been fired.

Everything fails everything right, but it's a small number. You have to look at the numbers. You have to look at how many per million failures you know and by the way, the lit the the nmc battery type 18650 cells. There's a long study that nasa did right because they wanted to know these batteries could be used safely, uh because they put them in their spacesuits.

They put them in their life, preserving systems in that little spacesuit, that people used in the 90s right and so they're, not just going to use whatever's out there, and so when they started doing uh research into what batteries were the best. The 18650 came out on top because it's the by far right now, the even now the most produced battery in the planet. It's been the use the most extensively throughout history for about 30 years. Think about how many laptops were in the 80s and late 80s and early 90s, every single one of those had uh 18650s and they trickled down to every single device electrical device right.

But until things start changing now start using pouches and now start using the 2170s and other farm form factors of batteries right, but this battery uh yeah it's pretty extensively used throughout the world and it's pretty safe. There are trillions of these patterns in the planet. Right now and yeah, some of them catch fire right a lot of times because they're being abused, because people are trying to vape, because people are over charging them because people are undercharging them because people are, you know overloading them with the load. That is that it shouldn't be doing and stuff stuff like that right, um, here's another thing that you need to uh also take into account these the first statement that he made most of these scooter and e-bike batteries are some flavor of energy batteries chemistry.

They are great for portable devices and portable power right. That is true, and that fact alone also makes them really safe for storage. Because think about this, when you have a little scooter, you have about 400 watt hours, uh of battery on board right, and so, when you're operating your little scooter that uh well that that scooter could sometimes uh be using up to like 500 600. Maybe a thousand watts right so you're discharging that battery at a rate of 2c right, so these batteries are safe enough in those conditions, they're designed that way, there's a lot of people that put thought into it and then they design all these little systems.

These little scooters right uh. These screws are not ultra unsafe, that they're every all of them are catching fire. You know they're out the batteries are not living the scooters. That's why i have a warehouse for these batteries right, so they're surviving that right.

There are external factors, and you know we can go on - that's a different subject or whatever, but they are. The fact is true that they are surviving the actual device and that's what we're having to find second life uses for that or repurposing for those right. But when you're building a power wall using these right most people, now i'm saying most people, because there are some case uh scenarios where you might want a battery that gives you all of its power in a short span, like maybe an hour right, a one hour Discharge on a battery pack, it's a 1c load right, but by far the most most of us that are trying to store energy for later use, we don't want one hour run time. We won five, six 10 24 hours of run time right, and so, if you're, trying to get 10 hours of run time out of your your battery whatever size it is, it could be one kilowatt hour, battery pack or a 100 kilowatt hour backpack.

But if you want a run time of 24 hours or 10 hours, that means you're discharging it at a rate of one tenth of one c. So, in that scenario, that battery is getting very a very easy life, it could do up to two c's, but you're only doing you know one 10th of a c discharge and then you're doing like if you want to charge it well, you know if you want To charge it again, you got to stay within the specs right uh, i think, like 2-3 hours, i think, is the fastest. You can charge on most of these batteries, but you know if you have six in the summer or anywhere five and a half hours of sunlight right in the average in the united states um. That means that you're charging them at half the speed that you can charge safely charging right so both of these scenarios you're using these batteries in a way that you're not stressing them out and therefore they're not going to get hot.

Why are they going to get hot if they can give you 20 times more energy than you're asking it? Why are they going to get hot? That's not how batteries work right, the way people or labs or manufacturers rate their batteries. Is they test them? They go. Okay, let's here's a battery that we made, we put it together, let's load it with the load and then once we see the the temperature rise, then then we know that's the limit right, and so then we just okay. So if it got hot, if it got too hot past the threshold that is deemed safe or whatever add 10 amps right, then that cell is like well that cell's not 10 amps.

We don't want people running at that. Let's run it eight amps or seven amps over there right and then they run that test at seven amps and then the temperature stay within that spec and then they repeat that a thousand times you know in that batch you know and then they're like okay. Now it is confirmed, this is the spec. This is what this battery is capable of, doing and staying within the safety.

The safe ranges of usability right, and so that's how they rate them. So when you, when they have these cells that are rated around 2c uh and they're being designed in battery packs to be used and you're using one-tenth or 120th or one-fifth of that, then these batteries are gon na, be very safe and they're gon na last. A long time another one of those things. This is not in this comment, but a lot of the the comments that i see people mention is that why would we use these even if they're, cheaper and maybe easier to build than a brand new lithium iron phosphate pack? Is you know when those can give you 6 000 cycles, but these are only a thousand cycles and by the way they have already some cycles because they're, you know kind of used second hand or whatever, well that the fact that we're using them as such, that We're giving them such uh easy life when we're building uh when we're using them in a powerwall scenario: storage, application.

Well that means that they're going to last forever that thousand cycles. That is rated by the manufacturer that is at full uh a full capacity right at full load. So basically that is the worst case scenario other than you know. You could abuse it and kill a battery instantly right, but if you stay within the specs right, if you hit peak of those specs, then they'll give you a thousand cycles uh.

We did a test with the chinese cell. That was rated at 800 cycles. Uh no 500 cycles and we loaded it with the same thing about 1c: no, it was 1 amp hour and it was a 26 right, so yeah less about half of a seat um and we were able to get far past uh far back. I think it's like 1100 cycles out of a 500 cycle battery right.

That was rated that way. So it's the same thing with these the easier you go on these batteries right, the bigger you big, the the battery pack, you build it right and then so then, the less cycles. If you don't cycle your battery every day, right from fully charged to fully discharged, then that means in a week you only put like two cycles in that battery. Those 500 cycles that you're gon na get they're gon na last.

You forever they'll, probably outlive you. You know um or they're gon na they're gon na last well past the point where it was worth the investment right, either in time or in money, and so that's the reason why i pushed these batteries right. I thought about all this stuff right and i you know i have to ask myself like if what i'm showing people, how to do is it worth it is? Is it having merit? Does that have anything, and so yeah i've come up with all these ideas to why? I think that doing this is it's valuable and it's worth it for some people, not everyone, not everyone is gon na some people are gon na, be better off just buying a turnkey system right because they don't wan na learn. They don't have time they're too busy.

You know maybe run a business or living their life. You know some people, just don't wan na learn right, but i am here for the people that do wan na learn and that's why i'm here sharing the knowledge, the anything that i'm learning i'm sharing with you right, and so i don't know all of it. I don't know it, i know very little of most things, but in this particular thing batteries i seem to have a little bit average knowledge, because i've been dealing with this for a long time. I've been dealing with batteries for about 10 years.

I built you know big, you know, projects like these cars that i'm building right. These are big batteries, you know 50 kilowatt hours, 100 kilowatt hours, and you know they are systems that could load those batteries out. You know my bus getting loaded at 700 amps right. So that's about uh, 80, kilowatts right so uh, but that's about 2c right, but that's a big giant battery right.

When we're talking about uh most of the storage systems, then yeah they're, usually a little smaller than that. You know i think most people can probably get away with putting a solar or a storage battery system in their house. You'd be 20 kilowatt hours 30 kilowatt hours. So you have a big house or 50 right uh.

If you like people who want to run continuously off-grid, you know with solar, then yeah. Those are the the guys that are doing 100 kilowatt-hour packs on their on their thing. But you know, if you think about the video that this comment was posted. It was because i was saying that you could buy a 100 kilowatt hour battery pack for about 10 grand right, and so you should probably consider that before you spend uh.

I don't know like a hundred thousand dollars on a 100 kilowatt hour battery system right or even like a tesla power wall that it's a 500 per kilowatt, 500 uh versus 100 right. So it's like 50, 50, 000 right, so anyways um. I hope this explains a little bit about why these batteries are not any more dangerous than then they're worth using right. There are safer ones and you won't get an argument for that.

Yeah lithium phosphate are some of the easiest ones, and i do have some of those i just built one. The last video was about a lithium-ion phosphate battery. Now it was not for storage, it's more for power, but yeah. I do have some in here that i am going to test and i'm going to build some systems to be able to do that, so i'm going to get into the lithium-ion phosphate right now.

The reason why i haven't gotten into it is because it's been very tough to get right. I would i n in good, conscious i can't send people to china to deal with chinese uh uh sellers to buy these really expensive batteries that take months to get here. Right now, some of the other youtubers are doing that and they're okay right and i was like well. I don't want to do that.

I'd rather deal with these like trash batteries, right that are cheaper, but they have some value and they might be harder to like work with. But you can get them right here and you're not going to get scammed right and i know the people who are selling them and you know even at one point then i got involved and i'm selling them right. So i know that i'm not gon na. I try not to scam anyone.

You know that you guys know that. I'm not about that and i have a track record. I've been here making videos talking about this and doing transactions. I have thousands and thousands of clients, uh customers that have bought stuff yeah, there's been some problems along the way.

Some people don't like me. People have felt that maybe you know some people might feel that i've been unfair or whatever. But i that's not what i'm here to do. You know what i mean like uh for the most part i try to be as fair as possible.

I try and treat people the right way and stuff, and so yeah that's why. But things are changing now batteries. There are many companies that are bringing lithium-ion batteries into the u.s and they're starting to uh, stock them and warehouse them locally. So now buying uh lithium-ion phosphate batteries is not the same thing as it was maybe like a year ago or two years ago, right where you'd have to just trust that some chinese seller was gon na, send ten thousand dollars worth of batteries in a boat.

And you would see it in two or three months or something you know so now things are changing, so i'm going to deal if you're interested in lithium or phosphate or if you're interested in this lithium covalxide uh. I will be able to have some information for you and even provide uh access to some of these batteries in the future right. So thank you for watching this video we'll see you guys on the next one and by the way, if you don't agree with me or you do agree with me post in the comments i do like i said i do try to read them all uh and Answer some of them. You know the ones that are that i can.

Okay, we'll see you guys bye.

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